First time FreeNAS

[tulth]

I am looking to setup a powerful home NAS system to replace the my current server.
Current Solution:
intel i3 NUC arch linux server with external usb3.0 seagate 5TB drive, serves files, plex, house backups, and some other things.

What I would like to do...
- I have 3 raspberry pi's with custom code that I would like to back up to the nas
- An arch linux desktop to backup
- serve plex to roku
- backup a win10 to the nas
- NFS share
- windows SMB share
- needs to be small and quiet

I was thinking I would periodically backup the Nas to somewhere, perhaps a cloud service.
(Could anyone recommend a cloud service that cannot decrypt your files? I was looking at Crashplan, but they keep a key to your files from what I gather).

After researching on here and reddit, I have the following proposed build:

Code:

|--------------+------------------------------+----------+---+-----------|
| Type		 | Item						 | Price Ea | # | Price	 |
|--------------+------------------------------+----------+---+-----------|
| cpu & mb	 | Supermicro X10SDV-4C-TLN4F   | $478.99  | 1 | $478.99   |
| memory	   | 16G DDR4 2133 ECC(288-Pin)   | $138.99  | 2 | $277.98   |
| storage	  | Intel 80GB M.2 (OS)		  | $63.50   | 1 | $63.50	|
| storage	  | WD Red 3TB (RaidZ2)		  | $109.99  | 6 | $659.94   |
| case		 | U-NAS NSC-810 Server Chassis | $209.99  | 1 | $209.99   |
| power supply | Seasonic SSR-450RM		   | $78.53   | 1 | $78.53	|
|--------------+------------------------------+----------+---+-----------|
| Total		|							  |		  |   | $1,768.93 |
|--------------+------------------------------+----------+---+-----------|

Note: I have a CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD PFC Sinewave UPS that I'm going to use with it.

Is the motherboard a good choice?
Do I need to buy a CPU fan?
Anything missing?

Thanks!!

 

[SCS]

After researching on here and reddit, I have the following proposed build:

Code:

|--------------+------------------------------+----------+---+-----------|
| Type		 | Item						 | Price Ea | # | Price	 |
|--------------+------------------------------+----------+---+-----------|
| cpu & mb	 | Supermicro X10SDV-4C-TLN4F   | $478.99  | 1 | $478.99   |
| memory	   | 16G DDR4 2133 ECC(288-Pin)   | $138.99  | 2 | $277.98   |
| storage	  | Intel 80GB M.2 (OS)		  | $63.50   | 1 | $63.50	|
| storage	  | WD Red 3TB (RaidZ2)		  | $109.99  | 6 | $659.94   |
| case		 | U-NAS NSC-810 Server Chassis | $209.99  | 1 | $209.99   |
| power supply | Seasonic SSR-450RM		   | $78.53   | 1 | $78.53	|
|--------------+------------------------------+----------+---+-----------|
| Total		|							  |		  |   | $1,768.93 |
|--------------+------------------------------+----------+---+-----------|

Note: I have a CyberPower CP1500PFCLCD PFC Sinewave UPS that I'm going to use with it.

Is the motherboard a good choice?
Do I need to buy a CPU fan?
Anything missing?

Thanks!!

I would be cautious of the MB as I couldn't find any reference to anyone running that board and FreeNAS. I would suggest looking at each of the chipsets to ensure compatibility.

an 80GB M.2 OS drive seems very excessive, but for the price it doesn't seem not unreasonable just a bit overkill.

I think the PSU should be alright as my 10 drive system barley exceeds 300w while booting, actually running once drive are spun up is drastically less. I would expect the system to be about 100w continuous draw, load would be more.

As long as your case has sufficient airflow directed over the heatsink through the system you may be fine without a dedicated CPU fan.

 

[JohnDigital]

I think the board will work, but I do think you should consider going with a standard x10 board and xeon cpu--if not an X11, the hardware is more widely available (new).. The cost might even be cheaper. Swell X10 boards like the X10SSL-F (only 6 sata ports be aware of that), the same board I run can be had for cheap these days and a Xeon chip for it, is around 200-300 dollars. Its all just a matter of preference. The other thing is the SoC board does not have anything in the way of expansion ports. I mocked up a build HERE that is a better all around system, and is a bit cheaper actually--it also has 8 sata 3 ports. The case you chose is not available from pcpartpicker so add 210.00 for that. +/- $1735.52

Either way you go, the machine I mocked up should be able to handle whatever you plan to do with it, now and in the future. I would consider running 2 SSDs in a RAID mirror for jails, and simply booting from a pair of 8gb USB flash drives. 80GB is woefully overkill for a freenas boot drive, but it WILL work. Its just that 72GB of that 80GB is just going to be wasted. The case is the aesthetic part of any computer and the one you chose is cool, but do you need it? You can shave quite a bit of cash off of your build by going with a Fractal Designs case amongst others. They are cool, quiet and beautiful. Hot swap drive cages are nice, but in reality you might use it once every couple years or so. As stated its all a matter of preference.

At any rate, welcome and good luck!!

 

[tulth]

Just a caution to anyone reading... the u nas case only takes a 1u psu. I noticed this after more research. This is making me seriously reconsider this case.

I was looking at the e3 1200s too. I was having a hard time judging which would be best. I was leaning towards the xeon d because of the lower power and passive cooling, but your feedback is making me seriously reconsider. I will update this when I get home.

 

[SCS]

I was initially leaning towards the Avaton chips but after reading time and time again that these higher tdp CPUs throttle way down when not in use I just though back to my i7-4790k. It sips power when its not doing anything.

When going from the embedded AMD APU to this I saw maybe a 10w-15w difference when running the same drives. Then again it was a dual core CPU, uATX MB, 2x8GB ram vs going to the Xeon, full size dual nic with dedicated ipmi (which is always running), 64GB ram.

If you want to save on long term electrical use look at a gold or better 80+ efficiency on your PSU.

I played around with some bronze PSU's that were far better fut for the power usage, but the shear effiency of the one in my sig shaved about 15w off the total draw measured at my UPS.

If you want me to test something and get you some power draw numbers I can as that is something I found quite lacking when I was looking and planning my build.

 

[tulth]

Scs,

What psu did you use in your build?

John,
I noticed you mentioned 2 usb drives...why 2? mirroring? separate syslog drive? just to have a spare?

thanks!

 

[JohnDigital]

Yes a mirror. Absolutely I would do this. Sandisk cruzer fits are the standard these days and at a few bucks you could very cheaply go with 4 in a mirrored stripe, or raid z2 but it isnt necessary.. Id have system pool in with your jails in a SSD mirror.

Again, good luck and welcome.

 

[danb35]

Could anyone recommend a cloud service that cannot decrypt your files? I was looking at Crashplan, but they keep a key to your files from what I gather

Crashplan has a few options for encryption; one of them uses a locally-generated key that they never get.

 

[SCS]

Scs,

What psu did you use in your build?

thanks!

I used an Antec Earthwatts 650w 80+Platinum (EA-650 Platinum). I had great luck with it my my gaming rig for the last two years so I used it again.

Its not modular and there aren't a whole lot of SATA port so I just made my own SATA female to 6 SATA Male adapters. I'll end up building a newer revision once I get my 3x5.25" bay to 5x3.5" caddy adapters. I'll probably adapt those off of the GPU aux power plugs.

Quite over powered, although my case can support up to 22 x 3.5" and 8 x 2.5" drives so I wanted enough juice to handle that if I actually went down that road.

After seeing the power jump from 5900rpm to 7200rpm along with going from 4 to 10 drives it became apparent I wasn't looking to actually fill the case without a considerable financial incentive to offset cost.

Could anyone recommend a cloud service that cannot decrypt your files?

look at TarSnap

 

[tulth]

Update, order sent out:

Code:

|
|--------------+-------------------------------------+----------+---+---------+-----------------------------|
| Type		 | Item								| Price Ea | # | Price   | Comment					 |
|--------------+-------------------------------------+----------+---+---------+-----------------------------|
| cpu		  | Xeon E3-1230						| 229.99   | 1 | 229.99  | combo deal!				 |
| motherboard  | SUPERMICRO MBD-X11SSM-F-O		   | 209.99   | 1 | 209.99  | combo deal!				 |
| memory	   | Kingston 16G DDR4 2133 ECC(288-Pin) | $138.99  | 2 | $277.98 |							 |
| storage	  | WD Red 3TB (RaidZ2)				 | $99.00   | 2 | $198.00 | for storage (limited stock) |
| storage	  | WD Red 3TB (RaidZ2)				 | $106.99  | 2 | $213.98 | for storage				 |
| storage	  | Ironwolf 3TB						| $109.95  | 2 | $219.90 | for storage				 |
| storage	  | SanDisk SSD2 120GB				  | $49.99   | 2 | $99.98  | for os					  |
| case		 | Fractal Node 804					| 106.99   | 1 | 106.99  |							 |
| power supply | Seasonic G-550					  | 69.99	| 1 | 69.99   |							 |
|--------------+-------------------------------------+----------+---+---------+-----------------------------|
| Total		|									 |		  |   | 1626.8  | plus some shipping		  |
|--------------+-------------------------------------+----------+---+---------+-----------------------------|

Wish me luck! I am playing around with freenas in virtualbox right now while waiting for parts.

 

[Wayland Sothcott]

I was thinking I would periodically backup the Nas to somewhere, perhaps a cloud service.
(Could anyone recommend a cloud service that cannot decrypt your files? I was looking at Crashplan, but they keep a key to your files from what I gather).

Thanks!!

That looks like an excellent hardware build.
I would remind you that the Cloud is a public space and the company operating it has the legal duty to go through all your files to make sure you're not a bad boy. If they see anything they don't like they call the police. Hackers also have unimpeded access to all your stuff on the Cloud if they feel like it.

So whatever backup system you use to put files on the Cloud make sure the files themselves are fully encrypted and no one can open them. That in itself is illegal since if they can't open your files it's assumed you're a terrorist unless you can prove otherwise.

It would be better to set up a friend with the same server as this and he can be your Cloud and you can be his.

 

[SCS]

That looks like an excellent hardware build.
I would remind you that the Cloud is a public space and the company operating it has the legal duty to go through all your files to make sure you're not a bad boy. If they see anything they don't like they call the police. Hackers also have unimpeded access to all your stuff on the Cloud if they feel like it.

I'm not sure about the legal or state policies but this isn't accurate. Backup companies don't have a legal duty to go through your data here in The States as you suggest. Data is scanned to see if there are MD5 matches to known items like child pron, and it is analysed for data mining and marketing services. Maybe that is how it is over there in the UK, if so that is down right terrifying.

So whatever backup system you use to put files on the Cloud make sure the files themselves are fully encrypted and no one can open them. That in itself is illegal since if they can't open your files it's assumed you're a terrorist unless you can prove otherwise.

I agree with the first part about encrypting to the cloud provider, more to protect against them being hacked and for breaking their data mining capability. Again here in the US we are not guilty of terrorism for using encryption, that sounds like another privacy issues with UK policies.

It would be better to set up a friend with the same server as this and he can be your Cloud and you can be his.

This I completely agree with.

 

[Wayland Sothcott]

I'm not sure about the legal or state policies but this isn't accurate. Backup companies done have a legal duty to go through your data here in The States as you suggest. Maybe that is how it is over there in the UK, if so that is down right terrifying.



I agree with the first part about encrypting to the cloud provider, more to protect against them being hacked and for breaking their data mining capability. Again here in the US we are not guilty of terrorism for using encryption, that sounds like another privacy issues with UK policies.



This I completely agree with.

Obviously I am overstating it. Everyone is innocent unless they want to get you for something. If your activities require encryption then the chances are you're doomed anyway. If not they why even bother because you could lock yourself out. With the recent Vault 7 Wikileaks release it shows the spies do have plenty of tools and are prepared to use them.

Let's say you were investigating child abuse. For a start you would not want anyone to have access to your evidence since even having such evidence is illegal. In the UK if you don't unencrypted your data when requested then that's also against the law. If they do discover you have child abuse evidence then that's a matter of national security and you could be locked in solitary confinement without trail until you lose your mind or kill yourself. I'm using an extreme example. I have nothing to hide and nothing to fear but some people really are in a perilous predicament because they chose to take action.

Note: BBC investigators were reported to the police by Facebook after they tried to get Facebook to remove images of child porn. Facebook were trying to get the reporters into trouble after they tricked the reporters into emailing them the very images they were trying to get Facebook to remove. The switcheroo failed and Facebook got into trouble. This is an example where holding these illegal images under encryption and where they can't be lost would be a good insurance. As long as they don't twist your arms and make you unlock them.

As I said before, I am overstating it. I can't think of any data I have that would need encryption unless I was storing it on the cloud, which I never do anyway. Same for most people, most stuff is too boring to worry about.

 

[tulth]

OK! So the parts came in and I have been doing the hard drive burn in procedure...

One of the drives has reported 3 errors while running badblocks after about 12 hours of running. The others are reporting 0 so far.

Should I RMA the drive? Will the manufacturer accept this for an RMA? (I have not done a hard drive RMA before)

Edit, added current smart output (see 197 current pending):

Code:

ID# ATTRIBUTE_NAME		  FLAG	 VALUE WORST THRESH TYPE	  UPDATED  WHEN_FAILED RAW_VALUE
  1 Raw_Read_Error_Rate	 0x002f   200   191   051	Pre-fail  Always	   -	   37
  3 Spin_Up_Time			0x0027   100   253   021	Pre-fail  Always	   -	   0
  4 Start_Stop_Count		0x0032   100   100   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   1
  5 Reallocated_Sector_Ct   0x0033   200   200   140	Pre-fail  Always	   -	   0
  7 Seek_Error_Rate		 0x002e   100   253   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   0
  9 Power_On_Hours		  0x0032   100   100   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   21
 10 Spin_Retry_Count		0x0032   100   253   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   0
 11 Calibration_Retry_Count 0x0032   100   253   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   0
 12 Power_Cycle_Count	   0x0032   100   100   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   1
192 Power-Off_Retract_Count 0x0032   200   200   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   0
193 Load_Cycle_Count		0x0032   200   200   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   5
194 Temperature_Celsius	 0x0022   115   112   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   35
196 Reallocated_Event_Count 0x0032   200   200   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   0
197 Current_Pending_Sector  0x0032   200   200   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   1
198 Offline_Uncorrectable   0x0030   100   253   000	Old_age   Offline	  -	   0
199 UDMA_CRC_Error_Count	0x0032   200   200   000	Old_age   Always	   -	   0
200 Multi_Zone_Error_Rate   0x0008   200   200   000	Old_age   Offline	  -	   0

 

[Glorious1]

See https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?resources/hard-drive-troubleshooting-guide.17/
You'll probably want to do a long smart test after badblocks is done.

 

[tulth]

I went ahead and requested an RMA with western digital. Here's to hoping I get a better drive that the one I am returning...

 

[SCS]

Bad blocks aren't unusual at all. the drive had spare blocks reserved for when this happens, although i would follow your path and swap it out given they are new drives.

Although not a great recovery tool and somewhat out of date I still run a program called Spinrite on ever one of my drives on it's most throughout testing procedure, it takes a while but beats the crap out of the drive and gives me good peace of mind going forward knowing the drive was at least good at this point in time.
Backups and redundancy are the peace of mind going forward.