A little warning regarding Sandisk Cruzer Fit USB drives

[DaveF81]

As everyone knows, having a mirrored boot volume is a good thing. It helps with fault tolerance, allows the system to keep running even when something breaks. However, I came across an issue I didn't really expect. Turns out that not all Sandisk Cruzer Fit USB drives are build equally. This is bad because they are the most recommended drives for booting as the hardware failure rate is fairly low.

This is something I found out when one of my Cruzer drives started to degrade and needed replacement after a years worth of service. Two new drives I ordered from Amazon (Canada) were approximately 350MB smaller in terms of capacity. I didn't notice this at first, but when trying to re-silver, my FreeNAS box complained the target drive was too small. I began to cuss and rage in the IRC chat room. Nothing could be done of course, but hey, it was nice to vent my frustrations somewhere and I appreciate that people were rather nice and supportive about it (I know I can be annoying sometimes in the chat room!).

So, my old drive reported (Model SDCZ33-016G-A46):
da1: 15267MB (31266816 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 1946C)

Where as the new drive (Model SDCZ33-016G-B35):
da0: 14907MB (30529536 512 byte sectors: 255H 63S/T 1900C)

Clearly with the model numbers there has been a hardware refresh. Now, the kicker here is that I cannot re-silver my boot volume to the new drive as it's smaller, forcing my hand to backup my configuration and re-install FreeNAS from scratch. Not a huge deal, it meant an hour or two of no file or media services for the family.

When I reached out to Sandisk for support to find out why I was missing 350MB, I was given some bull crap about the operating system taking some of that storage for itself. I can understand that with a filesystem on the drive, some space might be occupied or calculated different dependent on the file system, however when there is no data, partitions or file systems on the drive the capacity was still lower.

Steve K.: Dave, I understand the issue but it completely is the limitation with the operating system. It occupies some space from the Flash memory.
Steve K.: We manufacture the Flash memory against full capacity.
Dave: Even when completely formatted? erased? zero on it. not even a partition?
Steve K.: Dave, I have looked into the information and I would like to inform you that our Flash Drives provide a space of 14.9 GB on operating systems. I am not sure why are you getting nore then 14.9 GB of space

I guess Steve didn't know about the hardware refresh, wiping out 350MB. This type of story isn't typical of the manufacturing/engineering teams not informing their support staff. We've all been there, where the server or networking guy made a change which caused a support headache for the rest of the week.

Of course, I was assured the issue was going to be escalated.

Steve K.: I really apologize and surely will forward this case to have a look into the issue.

That was three weeks ago.

So, this is just a heads up. Maybe I got unlucky, but I have to wonder who else has come across this issue, it'll be interesting to find out.

 

[cyberjock]

Ugg... that's disappointing.

Two things I want to say:

1. I believe that the community has asked for a fix for this before (create an unformatted partition on the boot device), but was shot down as not a good solution.
2. In all honesty, just watching all of the problems coming and going, if you are truly shooting for reliability, doing mirrors on USB is not the way to go. The real way to go is a SATA DOM or an inexpensive (not cheap, inexpensive) SSD.

Yes, there's no mirror with a single SATA DOM, but people with SATA DOMs avoid all sorts of other problems such as compatibility with booting from USB, performance implications with USB which sometimes affect the system's reliability, and other random issues that are regularl pinned on USB.

If I were the boss and what I said was how things went, I would start recommending SATA DOMs and SSDs first if reliability is important (yes, even over mirrored USBs), and secondly go for USB if there are other bigger problems. SATA DOMs are not excessively expensive (my 32GB SATA DOM was $55 or so) and it was a good $55 spent as I have had no issues so no downtime, no hassle, and no need to do an RMA or buy yet another USB stick.

I do have a USB based FreeNAS system still, and I hate the thing (passionately). It's horribly unreliable, has problems with updating at times (I always do it from the CLI because the GUI often times-out and the upgrade fails mid-way through), and is generally just a pain to deal with. I avoid shutting it down, I avoid rebooting it, and I avoid upgrading it because I never know if its going to actually work or require 2 or 3 tries.

 

[Ericloewe]

Besides updates being painfully slow, I haven't had any bad experiences. Boots could be faster, but they're still faster than a laptop booting from an HDD.

The ultra-tiny SanDisks have a reputation for being crazy-ass slow, though. That's why I went with a different type of USB drive.

 

[DaveF81]

2. In all honesty, just watching all of the problems coming and going, if you are truly shooting for reliability, doing mirrors on USB is not the way to go. The real way to go is a SATA DOM or an inexpensive (not cheap, inexpensive) SSD.

I know a SATA DOM would admittedly be better, but they are expensive and not readily available over here in the great white north. The ones that are available are only suitable for SuperMicro motherboards. On the other hand, the Sandisk Cruzer Fit drives are super cheap and can be had for around $12 (16GB) each. The most inexpensive and smallest SSD I can get is a Kingston 30GB for around $50. For two, it'll cost me $100 plus tax/shipping. I'll eventually get around to doing this, but right now, I can't really afford to do this.

 

[cyberjock]

I know a SATA DOM would admittedly be better, but they are expensive and not readily available over here in the great white north. The ones that are available are only suitable for SuperMicro motherboards. On the other hand, the Sandisk Cruzer Fit drives are super cheap and can be had for around $12 (16GB) each. The most inexpensive and smallest SSD I can get is a Kingston 30GB for around $50. For two, it'll cost me $100 plus tax/shipping. I'll eventually get around to doing this, but right now, I can't really afford to do this.

The place where I bought mine (forget the website and can't find my bookmark) ships worldwide, and was reasonably priced IMO.

It's totally cool if you can't afford it, but the tradeoff is that you'll potentially have downtime. So long as you are aware of the tradeoff and okay with it, more power to you. It's just risk analysis versus benefits. ;)

 

[Jailer]

Yeah if your tight on sata connector space or don't want the added expense then a USB drive is surely the way to go. IMHO, and this is nothing more than my opinion, even if you have mirrored boot USB drives you better have a spare or two on hand as a backup. They're cheap enough that there is no reason not to.

 

[JoanTheSpark]

total dumb question, but would a preemptive workaround be to use less of the USB sticks volume from the start.. like putting just 12GB 'partition' onto the 16GB stick and mirror that?

 

[DataKeeper]

I initially looked at and bought 8 USB Sandisk Cruzer FIT drives. Used 2 as a mirrored boot and the other 6 as a raidz2 to play with. After reading on the down sides with them as boot media I looked at SSD drives but didn't want the extra cables so went with the Sata DOMs. Had one that was bad which caused the bios no longer boot them and took sometime to figure out. Even Supermicro hadn't run across this issue before, or at least the tech I was working with hadn't. Replaced the bad DOM and all is well. From what I've read this us quite a rare thing to happen but hey.. it was me after all!

As usual, it comes down to money. Yes they are more expensive but they are much faster, more reliable, not crappy USB, don't require additional cabling and really quite cute little things plugged into the board. :D

For any new system I'd highly suggest people use DOMs and to look at the newer boards with dedicated DOM ports. If additional wires are ok and you have free Sata ports then by all means pickup a couple small, inexpensive Sata SSD drives and use them. IMO USB drives should really be the last choice and to expect issues in regards to the typical unreliable USB issues, different specs on replacements, ultra slow speeds, high failure rates and the understanding that there is a much higher chance of needing to do a complete reinstall to new drives followed by a backup restore.... You do have lots of configuration backups yes? :) I'd also suggest ordering 5-6 of them right from the get go to have matching spares on hand. I've heard of size changes on them before though not with the Cruzer drives.

Also, for long term and future use buy larger sized media. I'd suggest at least 32G at least if not 64g. Tons of free space for backup boot restores, ensures room for future releases of larger sizes, etc.

To the OP.. Many sites in the US will ship to Canada including Newegg and Amazon. Again.. price is higher yet due to extra shipping costs and common import fees I know. I'm from NS originally but state side these days.

 

[Bidule0hm]

As usual, it comes down to money. Yes they are more expensive but they are much faster, more reliable, not crappy USB, don't require additional cabling and really quite cute little things plugged into the board. :D

Only one problem: they use SATA ports...

 

[DataKeeper]

Only one problem: they use SATA ports...

How's that a problem? Even if you don't have any spare ports you can always install a PCI Sata III expander for $30 bucks. Not something I'd do in a production system but for home users is acceptable. If building a new system simply ensure it has enough ports or better yet the dedicated DOM ports.

 

[Ericloewe]

How's that a problem? Even if you don't have any spare ports you can always install a PCI Sata III expander for $30 bucks. Not something I'd do in a production system but for home users is acceptable. If building a new system simply ensure it has enough ports or better yet the dedicated DOM ports.

Beyond 6 drives, there's the non-inconsequential cost of an HBA (or Xeon E5 system). I'm not touching any Marvell SATA controllers with a 10 foot pole - I've had my share of them on my old Nehalem system.

 

[DaveF81]

To the OP.. Many sites in the US will ship to Canada including Newegg and Amazon. Again.. price is higher yet due to extra shipping costs and common import fees I know. I'm from NS originally but state side these days.

Newegg US doesn't ship to Canada. As for Amazon, that's only true if the seller (that's not Amazon) will ship to Canada. The exchange rate makes it even more expensive than buying in Canadian dollars. I will eventually get a couple of SSDs for booting, but my USB thumb drives are working, plus I have a couple spare.

 

[Darren Myers]

I picked up 2 intel 80Gb SSD's and threw them in a mirror

 

[BigDave]

Newegg US doesn't ship to Canada. As for Amazon, that's only true if the seller (that's not Amazon) will ship to Canada. The exchange rate makes it even more expensive than buying in Canadian dollars. I will eventually get a couple of SSDs for booting, but my USB thumb drives are working, plus I have a couple spare.

I purchased this 16GB DOM and it was shipped from Canada, it took a long time to arrive (over two weeks).
afaik this company is based and ships from Montreal, Canada!
I know this product to be reliable as it has never so much as blinked while running the very first version
of 9.3 and all the updates that have come down thus far.
I did not end up liking the "horizontal" nature of this DOM, the fit for some boards would be difficult,
and in some cases, impossible.

 

[Jailer]

Your link is broken BigDave

 

[BigDave]

I think it's (the above link) fixed now...
The website acts a bit weird... took several tries
I just wanted to help my neighbors to the North in case
someone else is looking for DOMs in Canada :)

 

[gpsguy]

This is how you should spell neighbours. And end your sentence with an eh! ;-)






Sent from my phone

 

[DataKeeper]

Newegg US doesn't ship to Canada. As for Amazon, that's only true if the seller (that's not Amazon) will ship to Canada. The exchange rate makes it even more expensive than buying in Canadian dollars. I will eventually get a couple of SSDs for booting, but my USB thumb drives are working, plus I have a couple spare.

I meant to reply to this but forgot.. there are other places in Canada to order from such as Newegg.ca who do carry sata doms. Everything is more expensive in Canada! Gotta love Free Trade, Customs and the rest of the BS fees and taxes up there. :) I've thought MANY times of moving back permanently but I'd have to be nuts! Instead I return a few times a year, 2-3 months each year, to visit friends and family.

 

[DataKeeper]

This is how you should spell neighbours. And end your sentence with an eh! ;-)

Neighbours only if your in Canadian frenchie land somewhere.. otherwise everywhere else it should be neighbors.. eh!

 

[gpsguy]

Given that a Canadian dollar is only worth 76 cents US, that drives up prices for many goods. And, then add on the PST/GST or HST on top of that.

But, Canadians also receive a lot of benefits that aren't common in the US. Someone's got to pay for those benefits. :-(

Everything is more expensive in Canada! Gotta love Free Trade, Customs and the rest of the BS fees and taxes up there.

10+ years ago, we used to visit Canada quite often (monthly or more). In recent years, we only get up there 2-3 times a year for pleasure.