To boot with USB or SSD or NVMe ?

[blanchet]

USB sticks are not recommended because they have usually a poor writing endurance. But if you plug a SSD through the USB port, it will work well.

• I have an HPE Microserver Gen8. I boot with a USB3-to-SATA adapter and a Kingston SSD 120 GB. It works very well for years.
• On my iXsystems servers, the boot is provide by a pair for 32GB SataDOM

 

[Constantin]

I couldn't agree more, the use case matters.... in most configurations I have seen here, if the primary boot drive fails then the user has a dead system until they reconfigure the motherboard to boot from the alternate/good device and sometimes that also means physically removing the failed device. The only true way to implement a mirrored boot pool that would bootstrap even with a fault is to use a RAID card that would control this action,

Hi my friend and nice to hear from you.

I'll raise the counterpoint that my BIOS allows me to set up a multi-drive boot drive order - external USB goes first (for Memtest and the like) followed by the two SATADOMs or SATA drives. Thus, a catastrophic failure is covered - either the first boot drive is toast (in which case the BIOS moves to drive 2) or the drive is corrupt, in which case even hardware RAID may or may not save you without physical access to the machine.

However, a second drive allows you to isolate the bad drive, the config file is known to be good, and hence recovery is as quick as pulling the bad drive, popping in a new one, and rebuilding the boot drive mirror via the GUI. I believe there is a lot of value in that, especially for GELI-encrypted volumes.

Additionally, if you're offsite and SMART errors start piling up for one of the two boot drives, it's easy enough to disable the bad drive in the pool and let the other one soldier on until the dying drive can be replaced. That likely needs IPMI access at a minimum for reboot scenarios (BIOS boot order and all that) but the machine can keep running in the meantime.

If TrueNAS / FreeNAS allowed it via the GUI, I would even consider creating a 3-way mirror on a temporary basis every time the system is about to get updated and again after it's stable post-update to have a known good boot drive in case something goes sideways with the other two as a result of the update.

Returning a system back to normal use from a saved config may be childs play for you, I'm a beginner at it. Plus, I have yet to face a SATADOM failure. But my main motherboard has two SATADOM receptacles and the other has spare SATA ports, so I see no downside to using a mirrored boot pool. That said, your observations are spot on. As with everything we do with our servers, a 100% uptime or 100% data recovery is unlikely to be attainable. Failures can and do happen, and some of them are such edge cases that they're hard to anticipate.

So thank you and I hope you and your loved ones have a great set of holidays also.

 

[Constantin]

And FWIW, I have read enough horror stories here re: cheap USB drives giving up the ghost of Christmas that I'd preferentially go with a <$20 SSD (128GB or less) on a SATA interface, or less ideally a external SATA/NVME enclosure via USB. All of my motherboards have so many SATA ports that I cannot fill them all, so it's easy for me to say.... but then again, how much is that data worth to you and is saving $20 really worth it?

Granted, some advanced planning is necessary but there are really great server boards out there like the X10SDV-2C-7TP4F, that offer a low power CPU perfect for home storage server use, SFP+, IPMI, two m.2 slots (with one PCI3.0x4), two PCIe 3.0x8 slots, 2 SATADOMs, 18 regular SATA on top, etc. all at a price point around less capable Atom boards. This board is a bargain... but use case matters! DOn't expect to run a billion VMs on this, etc. There are only two cores / four threads available.

 

[joeschmuck]

Hi my friend and nice to hear from you.

It is good to hear from you as well.

I think there are a lot of scenarios which could happen and things would or wouldn't work out to our favor. My main point is just that it's not an automatic fix in all situations. So long as the word gets out that is my goal. I think that we do tend to have our personal preferences and I do hope that I clearly state in my postings that this is my opinion.

And FWIW, I have read enough horror stories here re: cheap USB drives giving up the ghost of Christmas that I'd preferentially go with a <$20 SSD (128GB or less) on a SATA interface, or less ideally a external SATA/NVME enclosure via USB.

I couldn't agree more, USB Flash drives are not as reliable and tend to fail early when used in this application. Use a SSD type device if at all possible.

 

[Dan Tudora]

I think there are a lot of scenarios which could happen and things would or wouldn't work out to our favor.

agree

My main point is just that it's not an automatic fix in all situations

just in some

Granted, some advanced planning is necessary but there are really great server boards out there like the X10SDV-2C-7TP4F, that offer a low power CPU perfect for home storage server use, SFP+, IPMI, two m.2 slots (with one PCI3.0x4), two PCIe 3.0x8 slots, 2 SATADOMs, 18 regular SATA on top, etc. all at a price point around less capable Atom boards. This board is a bargain... but use case matters! DOn't expect to run a billion VMs on this, etc. There are only two cores / four threads available.

I understung you seal that one IF not JUST send me ONE
Happy New Y

I have read enough horror stories here re: cheap USB drives giving up the ghost of Christmas

ghost and Christmas on same sentence "Shame of you"
ear

 

[phier]

hello,
currently i am booting truenas using NVME drive inside PCIe adapter. Is it possible just move drive to nvme to usb adapter (https://www.amazon.de/-/en/Adapter-ANYOYO-Converter-Portable-Support/dp/B0BBRDWKLV) and boot it via USB?

Thanks!

 

[sretalla]

Is it possible just move drive to nvme to usb adapter

It might be possible in the simple sense (just move it over and boot)... that will depend on your BIOS allowing that to happen.

Otherwise, you would be able to move over the NVME and just install to it again and restore a config backup.

 

[phier]

@sretalla, thanks

so i was thinking about adapters like that, does it matter which one i go for?

Amazon.de

Amazon.de

what do you mean able to move over the NVME and just install to it again ... ?

As i know the board is it possible to say if thats supported? its https://www.supermicro.com/en/products/motherboard/X11SSM-F
but i need to release one pcie so thats the reason why i need to boot via USB.

OH and sorry - i need to boot ESXi ; as i have truenas within esxi ... so basically question would be can i boot / run ESXi using that usb to nvme adapter. Sorry for a confusion.

thanks!

 

[joeschmuck]

OH and sorry - i need to boot ESXi ; as i have truenas within esxi ... so basically question would be can i boot / run ESXi using that usb to nvme adapter. Sorry for a confusion.

ESXi will boot from a USB device. Your motherboard should support it as well, but you need to select the boot device in the BIOS (Boot Priority/Order). And moving the NVMe from the PCIe card to a USB adapter should work fine. And as I understand it, the NVMe has ESXi installed on it.

My only caution for you is... M.2 can be a PCIe or SATA interface. Make sure the USB adapter you use supports the NVMe you have.

 

[phier]

@joeschmuck
thank you,
so i was thinking about that adapter https://www.amazon.de/-/en/gp/product/B08RVC6F9Y/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A3V5NH794ZRV7G&psc=1

it says >

SABRENT M.2 SSD Case, USB C 3.2 to NVMe SSD, SATA SSD, 1TB, SSD, 2TB SSD, 4TB SSD, SSD 8TB, up to 16TB, Docking Station GEN 2,​

Then via cable plug it to my mainboard to usb port ; and boot ESXi from the nvme drive inside it.

thanks!

 

[joeschmuck]

I like that adapter you selected so much, I'm going to buy one right now. I read several reviews and it sounds like a good adapter. I would use it to connect any NVMe SSD card to when it's not in the computer. I have an NVMe SSD now waiting on a computer to arrive and there is a file on it that I can't access right now. This would come if handy right now and the price is reasonable.

 

[phier]

@joeschmuck question would be if its possible to boot from it ; for example ESXi

 

[joeschmuck]

@joeschmuck question would be if its possible to boot from it ; for example ESXi

I would assume it will boot from it but some hardware is not compliant so you need to try it out. I did purchase this adapter and I will try it. I see no reason it wouldn't work.

 

[phier]

@joeschmuck okay i ordered it too; will let know thanks!

 

[joeschmuck]

So the Sabrent M.2 to USB adapter showed up today. It works great! It is a complete toolless design. I'm not sure how long this M.2 connector would last if I had to install various M.2 cards all day long but for a few swaps a year, it seems to be good. The fact that it works with NVMe and SATA is great. The case is also a heatsink and I wasn't sure if it would make contact with the card, but it did and I could feel the case warm up when I was transferring data.

Transfer speeds Reading are 40MB/sec and Writing 39.5MB/sec over my old USB3.0 A-Type connector. This is not lighting fast as I would expect for a USB 3.0 connection but then again my adapter cable is 16' long and I normally use it for charging my smartphone and transferring photos off my phone, I'm sure this has something to do with it. I need to get a new shorter Type-A to Type-C cable, and only 1 foot long.

I will load a bootable image on it soon, ESXi to be exact and see what happens but right now I need to go change the oil in my daughters car and rotate her tires. A FATHERS JOB IS NEVER DONE.

 

[joeschmuck]

To follow up on this M.2 adapter... I bought a USB C to Type-A adapter rated for 10Gbit/sec but no change. It's slow, the 40MB/sec is as fast as it goes. But the good thing is I'm able to access data on any M.2 card and this was not an expensive item to purchase so I got what I paid for. Will it work as a boot device, absolutely. Is it super fast, Nope! I get over 100MB/sec on my 6 year old USB 3.0 32GB flash drive.

 

[phier]

hm thats strange - weird.... then adapter is junk?

 

[joeschmuck]

hm thats strange - weird.... then adapter is junk?

I wouldn't say that. I would say that you get what you pay for. 40MB/sec isn't terrible but it definitely isn't SS10 (Super Speed 10Gbit) transfer rates, well not for my testing and Samsung NVMe card. Maybe a SATA M.2 SSD would transfer faster, I really don't know. But at least I can use it to access an NVMe SSD if I need to. I would not use this device for fast storage but a boot drive such as TrueNAS, it should do the job and would be better than using a USB Flash Drive from a longevity perspective.

With all that said, I'm sure there are better/faster USB to M.2 adapters on the market.