Some hardware questions

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tome

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Most of the server motherboards I see have 4 sata2 and 2 sata3 ports. I want to build a box with at least 6 disks to start and add more in a different pool later. Does it matter if I buy 6, say ST4000VN0000 (Seagate 4T) sata III disks, and hook all 6 to these mix of ports initially? Is there a performance hit for putting them on sata2? If so, what would give better performance?

Also, what would I then add to the system to add more disks to it? I see caution about using pci disk boards due to pci thruput limitations but what does one do at that point?

Thanks
 

jgreco

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Contemporary 4TB drives transfer data at around 150MBytes/sec, or roughly 1.2 Gbits/sec. So if you put that drive on a manly 6Gbit/sec SATA port instead of a wimpy 3Gbit/sec SATA port, the 6Gbit/sec SATA port will be able to spend most of its time twiddling its thumbs, whereas that poor 3Gbit/sec SATA port might be busy up to 40% of its capacity! Oh, the horror. Call the silicon union...

To expand your system further, an additional SATA controller of some sort is recommended. PCI is not recommended, it is a 20 year old technology at this point. Its replacement is PCI Express, or PCIe. The main problem you'll have is that a lot of what is sold in the PC world is JUNK, manufactured from second-rate materials by forced slave labor of old ladies and preschoolers deep in Asia, then sold to some "brand" name who repackages it and sells it as theirs at massive markup. Ok so I'm partially kidding but you get the point, right? You can get any quality SATA adapter that is well-supported by FreeBSD and you will be very happy with it under FreeNAS. Just get a reputable one. If you are going to add more than two drives, then seriously consider getting a used IBM ServeRAID M1015 off eBay. This is a server-grade RAID/HBA card that can easily be bludgeoned into HBA mode, giving you a $75 totally awesome SATA controller. See sticky in this forum.
 

tome

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Ok, thanks. Do you have links for reasonable PCIe controller cards (are they list here in the forum somewhere)? The disks I have are SATA not SAS, is there a cable that let's you connect them to a SAS controller directly? I'm not familiar with SAS...
 

jgreco

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Only what I suggested. My cynical commentary re: PC hardware is the result of years of experience and observation.
 

tome

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Being more specific....Do you have a link to this magic list? "any quality SATA adapter that is well-supported by FreeBSD"
 

jgreco

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The point was really that you have to do some research. The FreeBSD hardware notes is only a starting point. Hardware that works is listed there. However, hardware that WORKS is a different thing. For example, the hardware notes list Realtek ethernets. That doesn't make them a good choice. But they're listed, because someone made them work... no amount of software magic can make crappy silicon work as well as a well-written driver for a high performance chip, which is why the recommendations for Intel ethernets are so frequent.

So you have to ascertain the compatibility with whatever FreeBSD driver supports something. Then you also have to ascertain the quality of the hardware, which is difficult because PC hardware isn't that great. Take a look at this. So really I have better things to do with my life, I'll usually buy server-grade stuff and usually won't have any problems.
 

tome

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Then you also have to ascertain the quality of the hardware, which is difficult because PC hardware isn't that great. Take a look at this. So really I have better things to do with my life, I'll usually buy server-grade stuff and usually won't have any problems.

So are you saying the Rosewill thing is crappy or good? I understand that most server-grade hardware is built to higher standards of QC, but not ALL pc hardware is shit either. I was hoping to learn from the mistakes of others, that there would be a list of known good (not shitty) hardware somewhere but I guess you are saying that isn't the case. Not all server grade hardware is stellar either...
 

pirateghost

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Rosewill is Newegg's house brand and is well known for its poor quality. It's cheap and not something I trust my data with. I rarely buy anything Rosewill branded and if I do it's something that isn't meant to be permanent

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
 

jgreco

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A house brand is a brand that is badged, and sold to a single retailer. The actual product being sold may be manufactured and sold under other brands. Rosewill does not meet this definition as they are sold by other retailers. However, this is mainly pedantry, if you were to say "a Newegg bargain brand" then yay.

The poster child for house brand around here would be ServeRAID, IBM's line of rebadged mostly-LSI products.

There are numerous retail brands like this: Rosewill, Syba, Startech, C2G, SIIG, etc., all of whose business models and product lines appear to be something in on the spectrum between design-it-have-Asia-make-it-container-ship-it-to-US to just-look-around-a-Shenzhen-back-alley-to-see-what's-being-sold-today. If you are looking for unusual minor bits and bobs, it often turns out that only one or two places in China actually makes what you're looking for, and everyone has the same product under a different label.

Now as I've said before, the problem in the PC market is that it is very competitive on price, and basically this results in a race to the bottom for the cheapest possible $#!+ that can still be claimed to work. If you build something that's quality and good, you're not going to be able to charge much more for it, so to a large extent, no one tries for consumer-grade gear. This is fine for Windows PC's where blue screens happen and bits go missing now and then. For those of us working with FreeBSD who have reasons to want our stuff to work, it results in a Hobson's choice scenario: you get one cheap POS SATA controller or another cheap POS SATA controller, both bad choices. So my solution to this is to move on to server-grade components, where a different set of market forces compels better hardware design. Unfortunately it is also exceedingly limiting in what your options end up being, but on the positive side, it tends to lead to good design decisions and reliability.
 

pirateghost

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Didn't know any other retailers were selling Rosewill. It used to be a Newegg exclusive. Either way I won't buy Rosewill for anything important.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
 
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