Please Help Me Design and Configure My System

[210Flyer]

I am about to start testing the hardware listed in my signature below, essentially a reference system from the recommended hardware thread. I don't want this to devolve into a hardware discussion. If there are glaring deficiencies, by all means, point them out and I will create a separate thread for discussion. My questions all revolve around the software configuration of my system. The following are planned uses for the system:

1. Media Server for my Home Theater using a KODI client on a NVIDIA Shield and ROKUs on other TVs around the house. My movies will be stored as .MKV files, but I may need .ISOs for Ultra HiDef Blu-Rays.
2. Photo Archive for family photos in various formats
3. File Server for various types of documents
4. Backup File system for several laptops - Apple and Windows
5. Music Server - Apple Lossless format

#1 only needs local network access via wired connections
#2-5 I would like remote access via internet as well as local network access via WiFi

I will only have 4 users plus a guest account, but none of the users are sophisticated or particularly patient (think high level execs with short attentions spans and short fuses). I have an even split between Apple and Windows users. Does this mean I should use CIFS?

I have not settled on any particular applications because I am a total newb in the FreeNAS/UNIX world. Because of this, I'm thinking it would be safer for me to rely on apps with a GUI for management rather than a CLI (but I could learn if that is the route for a best practices environment).

First off, storage configuration: I was thinking a single VDev in a RAIDZ2 for the 8 Ultrastars. I'm guessing I would then divide the VDev into 5 pools, one for each of the 5 tasks above. HELP NEEDED
Also, it seems that people are moving away from mirrored USB drives for the FreeNAS OS and are moving toward mirrored SSDs and SATADOMs. Are the plugins/jails installed onto the system drives (mirrored SSD pair) or onto the data drives (the RAIDZ2 VDev).

From my reading, it looks like PLEX and OWNCLOUD plugins would work, but I am asking for advice for a "best practices" sort of build. Are these two apps all that I will need and are they the best choice for my needs? I want to restrict privileges so that most of the users are READ ONLY except for adding new files/photos/backups but no MODIFY/DELETE privileges except for an administrator/me.

Is there an app/Plugin that will allow me to put all my music on my NAS and stream it to the laptops locally as well as transcode it to AAC for use on remote laptops and iOS devices with playlist functionality? I would also like to download transcoded AAC versions of our music onto iOS devices and Classic iPods (I don't mind jailbreaking the iPods with different firmware). Oh, and will it work better than iTunes? I want to get away from a local music library (and iTunes) on each laptop, if possible.

Thanks in advance for all your help. Also, like most newbs, I don't know what I don't know, so if I have missed or neglected a key component, please include it in your reply.

Mike

 

[Robert Trevellyan]

I was thinking a single VDev in a RAIDZ2 for the 8 Ultrastars.

Good.

I'm guessing I would then divide the VDev into 5 pools, one for each of the 5 tasks above.

When you said "pools" you probably meant to say "datasets". You might end up wanting more than one per task, depending on what level of control you want for permissions, shares, snapshots etc.

Are the plugins/jails installed onto the system drives (mirrored SSD pair) or onto the data drives (the RAIDZ2 VDev).

Jails belong on the data drives. The boot device is just for the OS.

I want to get away from a local music library (and iTunes) on each laptop, if possible.

Considering the way you characterize your users, and assuming they're already familiar/comfortable with iTunes, I'd skip the NAS and go with iTunes Match.

 

[210Flyer]

Thanks Robert, I'll take a look at iTunes Match.

If only the OS goes onto the boot device, why are people moving away from USB drives? Is it just for easier/faster upgrades of the OS?

Pools, datasets, VDevs, volumes - I'm really trying to use the correct terminology... Is there a basic reference that will help me understand the hierarchy. I come from a DOS/Windows world, so be gentle. Also, where should I go/what reference should I use to determine how to configure my datasets for the tasks I set forth in the original post.

Thanks,
Mike

 

[Robert Trevellyan]

why are people moving away from USB drives?

There have been many reports of USB devices failing. I believe the problem (presumably a result of too much writing to cheap flash) can be effectively mitigated by moving the system dataset and reporting database from the boot device to (one of) the main storage pool(s), which is easily done using the GUI.

Is there a basic reference that will help me understand the hierarchy. Also, where should I go/what reference should I use to determine how to configure my datasets for the tasks I set forth in the original post.

Aside from the official documentation, which you should study like a textbook and which includes links to some very good ZFS resources, another good source is the pinned threads in the New to FreeNAS? forum, particularly the "Slideshow ... for noobs".

It's also important to recognize that you're unlikely to be satisfied with your initial decisions once you become truly familiar with FreeNAS. Plan to start by spending several weeks experimenting with different setups before you commit anything large or important to the system. Then you can start over and do it right.

You'll notice I'm not giving you a recipe for configuring your system. There are infinite possibilities, based on different wants, needs and preferences.

 

[210Flyer]

iTunes Match will not work. It is currently a single user with multiple devices ecosystem rather than a family centric system where multiple members can access the iCloud share. It uses the AppleID on the device to enable share access and will only allow ONE AppleID per iCloud share. To prevent users from changing their device AppleID as needed, Apple only allows one AppleID change per device per 90 days. iTunes Match is for single people, not couples or families....kinda like Match.com

Oh well

It's also important to recognize that you're unlikely to be satisfied with your initial decisions once you become truly familiar with FreeNAS. Plan to start by spending several weeks experimenting with different setups before you commit anything large or important to the system. Then you can start over and do it right.

Although I do plan to test the system for several weeks before I fully populate the datasets, I was hoping to avoid the iterative refinement paradigm by seeking the experience and guidance of the forums. I don't want to find out X months from now that I should have used iSCSI instead of CIFS and have to reconfigure my whole system from scratch and repopulate all my datasets. Or that the level of user access I want to implement requires creating my own jails rather than relying on the GUI-enforced choices inherent in a strictly plug-in based design.

Like a carpenter, I can build a house from a set of plans, but I'm not an architect.

Mike

 

[danb35]

why are people moving away from USB drives? Is it just for easier/faster upgrades of the OS?

It is, and USB drives are pretty awful in terms of reliability.

Is there a basic reference that will help me understand the hierarchy.

https://forums.freenas.org/index.ph...ning-vdev-zpool-zil-and-l2arc-for-noobs.7775/
https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/terminology-and-abbreviations-primer.28174/
...and there's a thread by @Bidule0hm that I can't find right now.

 

[Bidule0hm]

...and there's a thread by @Bidule0hm that I can't find right now.

Here: https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/comprehensive-diagram-of-the-zfs-structure.38865/ :)

 

[DiViDeR]

I'm in a very similar position and will watch this thread for more info regarding #1 HTPC use. I currently use an 8 year old windows based mediaportal system which stores files locally and would like to use the NAS to store movies etc and replace the HTPC. Plex seems the way most people do this, but this is all new to me too!

 

[maglin]

I suggest getting familiar with BSD and command line. For what you want to do will require a fare amount of configuration and a single standard jail will be best resource wise. Also you will want to use 32 GB of ram as well. I can't see your specs as I'm on mobile but you will want a CPU that is a boule to handle a few transcodes at a time. The one in my sig has done 5 simultaneously and the system was still functioning properly.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[210Flyer]

OK, so here is the design so far as I understand:

Boot device: 2 x 128GB SSDs --> 1 mirrored VDev --> FreeNAS 9.10 Stable
Storage: 8 x 4TB HDDs --> 1 RAIDZ2 VDev --> 1 Pool --> 1 System Dataset with single Jail + 5 Datasets [Music, Videos, Pictures, Files, Laptop Backups]
No SLOG, no L2ARC

Within the single Jail, I would install several Apps such as PLEX Server and maybe OwnCloud and ???
I'm guessing only the Files dataset will need snapshots, as the other dataset files are static once written to the disc

Questions:
1. Does the configuration of the boot device and the storage device represent "best practices"?
2. For the "Laptop Backups" dataset, should I create a separate share for windows machines using CIFS and a separate share for Apple devices using AFP?
3. Does the Jail care whether the Apps use CIFS or AFP or both?

Thanks,
Mike

 

[nojohnny101]

@210Flyer your specs look good for what you want to do, you should have no problem. i only have 16gb of ECC RAM in my box and it has handled everything i have thrown at it so far (multiple shares, 4-5 active users for file sharing, 6-8 semi-active plex streams [remote and local], and plexpy).

Storage: 8 x 4TB HDDs --> 1 RAIDZ2 VDev --> 1 Pool --> 1 System Dataset with single Jail + 5 Datasets [Music, Videos, Pictures, Files, Laptop Backups]

i think you are a little confused, it would go:

[EDIT: got confused myself! Ignore.]

you should not be creating one jail and putting a bunch of plugins in that same jail. isolate each one. for example, create one dataset called "jails" then create a jail for each plugin you want to run (plex has its own jail, owncloud has its own jail, etc.)

1. Does the configuration of the boot device and the storage device represent "best practices"?

already answered above. i would recommend you search for, find and read cyberjock's noob guide powerpoint presentation. would go along way.

2. For the "Laptop Backups" dataset, should I create a separate share for windows machines using CIFS and a separate share for Apple devices using AFP?

the general rule is you should not have one dataset being accessed by two share services at the same time. it can screw things up. if you require AFP specific feature (such as time machine support) then yes i would create that separately. if not, stick with CIFS as Mac OS X works great with it just the same as AFP.

3. Does the Jail care whether the Apps use CIFS or AFP or both?

this question doesn't make sense. if you need data inside a jail, you don't actually put data in it. you create links from inside the jail to data outside the jail. for example, the way the plex jail works is you create "pointers" (not really sure about the technical term here, that might be wrong) inside the jail that points to your movies outside of the jail on any other dataset you have. proper permission allows the plex jail to access this media and use it.

i'm not going to go through all your original questions as other people have already contributed towards that, but have you considered using plex to serve up music to everyone? i currently use plex for movies, home videos, and tv shows but haven't played around with music yet but plex supports it. you might want to look into it. it is on my list but i haven't gotten around to it.

 

[210Flyer]

i think you are a little confused, it would go:

1 Pool --> 1 RAIDZ2 (8 x 4tb) --> how ever many jails and/or datasets

I was just using the convention from @BiduleOhm 's Comprehensive Diagram of the ZFS Structure shown in the link below
https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/comprehensive-diagram-of-the-zfs-structure.38865/

you said: "you should not be creating one jail an putting a bunch of plugins in that same jail. isolate each one. for example, create one dataset called "jails" then create a jail for each plugin you want to run (plex has its own jail, owncloud has its own jail, etc.)

but

@maglin said: "I suggest getting familiar with BSD and command line. For what you want to do will require a fare amount of configuration and a single standard jail will be best resource wise."

Is there a reference or thread that compares these two approaches, or am I reading this wrong and @maglin was referring to using a single template for all of the jails.

Thanks,
Mike

 

[Bidule0hm]

Storage: 8 x 4TB HDDs --> 1 RAIDZ2 VDev --> 1 Pool --> 1 System Dataset with single Jail + 5 Datasets [Music, Videos, Pictures, Files, Laptop Backups]

This is how it works.

1 Pool --> 1 RAIDZ2 (8 x 4tb) --> how ever many jails and/or datasets

This isn't.

 

[danb35]

the general rule is you should not have have one dataset being accessed by two share services at the same time.

Fixed that for you.

you should not be creating one jail an putting a bunch of plugins in that same jail.

I don't think there's really a "should" here, but certainly the default, when using plugins, is to put each plugin in its own jail.

 

[nojohnny101]

@danb35 @Bidule0hm sorry! I shall never type responses late at night, it clearly messes me up!

@210Flyer like @danb35 said, there is no disadvantage that I know of for creating a jail for each plugin you have. That is what was recommended to me from the experi need here on the forum.

 

[maglin]

Sorry I didn't expand. Enough. I didn't say what I meant properly. I wouldn't use plug ins at all. I would read up a little on FreeBSD command line commands and use a vanilla or standard jails and install the apps you want to use inside that one jail. You don't have separation of apps but you also use less RAM have only one jail running. I would use freshports and portsnap to install what you can and then git to install what isn't on freshports.
For sickrage go with the sickrage/sickrage fork as the sickrage/sickrageTV fork had issues with FreeBSD when I installed it a few months ago.
You will have to learn chown and chmod commands for ownership of files and folders.
I'm not well versed in FreeBSD but with some reading I have sickrage, sonnar, plex, sabnzbd, couch potato, plexpy, and htpcmanager all working in a single jail.
I'm not going to be home for a few weeks so I don't have any resources to point you too. So sorry for that. I also started with trying to use plug ins and multiple jails and I was having issues with a NIC on a jail just not work randomly. I ended up messing with that for about a day before I scraped it and started over with a single jail. Hope that gives you some insight to what I said earlier.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[pirateghost]

Always separate your jails and plugins. Don't put all your apps in one jail for one simple reason. If some app acts up, it is a whole lot easier to troubleshoot that one jail or blow it away and reload it than it is to rebuild a single jail with, say 8 apps running inside it.

I stand by the idea that your services should be separated and isolated for manageability.

 

[Robert Trevellyan]

services should be separated and isolated for manageability.

I'll make a case for partial isolation - assuming manual installation. In my case, one jail runs VirtualBox, one runs BTSync, and another runs Plex, Sonarr and SABnzbd. The last three work in concert, but the others are unrelated.

 

[pirateghost]

I'll make a case for partial isolation - assuming manual installation. In my case, one jail runs VirtualBox, one runs BTSync, and another runs Plex, Sonarr and SABnzbd. The last three work in concert, but the others are unrelated.

I agree. Running services that work together makes sense and I do that to some extent.

But running every service you want in a single VM is asking for downtime.

 

[210Flyer]

Thanks guys, I appreciate the discussion and the depth of your responses.
I will continue my research.

For those newbies without any UNIX or BSD experience looking for a better understanding of the underpinnings of FreeNAS, I went to the FreeBSD project. There you will find a comprehensive FreeBSD Handbook that probably covers everything we need to know about FreeBSD which forms the foundation of FreeNAS and is available in a number of languages and formats.