question on video: FreeNAS™ 8.0.1: Backups In Depth

[esamett]

http://www.freenas.org/videos.html

The video has us set up a windowsbackup dataset within a windowsbackup volume. The windowsbackup CIFS share links to /mnt/windowsbackup volume as does the Windows 7 backup configured. I followed directions as best as I could and my backup is going into the /mnt/windowsbackup. Is this an error? I thought that perhaps the backup was to be stored in /mnt/windowsbackup/windowsbackup. I know that Windows backup is very fussy with networks. I thought that is why the ACL in /mnt/windowsbackup/windowsbackup/ was set to Windows. It seems pointless if the backup is stored in /mnt/windowsbackup.

thanks for advice in advance

See screenshots 1 and 2. The only difference from video is that I call my server (netbios name): freenas

 

[cyberjock]

Nope, you told the backup(or moved the backup) to /mnt/windowsbackup(technically your share location). But Windows backup doesn't just create a single file and dump everything into it like Acronis, Symantec Ghost, etc. What you need to do is create folders inside your windowsbackup folder. For example, /mnt/windowsbackup/laptop and /mnt/windowsbackup/desktop and then point those machines to those folders.

 

[esamett]

Thank you for replying to both my postings. I now understand that the video is not produced by iX. I have been unable to find much information elsewhere on the Windows 7 Backup to FreeNAS. Perhaps you can help me further with my understanding.

Background:
I have been struggling to safely backup my bloated Windows 7 Professional PC, as well as the other computers in the house. Windows Backup does not recognize 4k sector ("big") drives and Acronis is "broken" for network backups after Echo Workstation which does not support Windows 7. So I am back to trying to work with Windows Backup over a network. My Promise NS4300 is too slow to be practical.

The problem with Windows Backup is that if you use a boot disk for catastrophic system recovery there is a problem with finding your backup image on network drives, ie: FreeNAS. This can leave you with a system difficult to restore. My Googling suggests that for this to work the backup image must be located in the "root" directory of the backup drive.

The instructional video (link above) sets up Volume /mnt/windowsbackup with Unix ACL, and a ZFS Dataset /mnt/windowsbackup/windowsbackup with Windows ACL. The CIFS Share windowsbackup points to /mnt/windowsbackup, and Windows Backup points to the Volume root /mnt/windowsbackup. The ZFS Dataset /mnt/windowsbackup/windowsbackup is not used.

Question:
I wish to clarify your comment: " What you need to do is create folders inside your windowsbackup folder. For example, /mnt/windowsbackup/laptop and /mnt/windowsbackup/desktop and then point those machines to those folders."

• By "folder" are you referring to a ZFS Dataset or a "plain vanilla" subdirectory? Web postings suggest that a "plain vanilla" subdirectory will not work with Windows 7 Backup.
• I don't understand the impact of Unix vs. Windows ACL on Windows Backup or Windows 7 in general.
• I want to know if bootdisk initiated Windows Restore will find a backup stored in the "root" of ZFS Dataset /mnt/windowsbackup/windowsbackup, or if I need to set up separate Volumes for each computer.
• Does the CIFS Share path impact if Windows Restore will find the backup

Answers to these questions will help me configure safe and reliable backups for my home network. I am willing to "work for my supper" if there are any experiments you would need for me to do to help with the Windows 7 vagaries. I am asking for your assistance mostly because I have limited understanding of networking between Windows and FreeNAS, sharing and the FreeBSD directory structures.

Regards,

Evan

 

[cyberjock]

The problem with Windows Backup is that if you use a boot disk for catastrophic system recovery there is a problem with finding your backup image on network drives, ie: FreeNAS. This can leave you with a system difficult to restore. My Googling suggests that for this to work the backup image must be located in the "root" directory of the backup drive.

And now you see why I used the Windows Backup a whole 3 times. After I tried to recover just to see how to do it and realized its not really possible over the network I said 'screw it' and used a 3rd party tool.

The instructional video (link above) sets up Volume /mnt/windowsbackup with Unix ACL, and a ZFS Dataset /mnt/windowsbackup/windowsbackup with Windows ACL. The CIFS Share windowsbackup points to /mnt/windowsbackup, and Windows Backup points to the Volume root /mnt/windowsbackup. The ZFS Dataset /mnt/windowsbackup/windowsbackup is not used.

Question:
I wish to clarify your comment: " What you need to do is create folders inside your windowsbackup folder. For example, /mnt/windowsbackup/laptop and /mnt/windowsbackup/desktop and then point those machines to those folders."

• By "folder" are you referring to a ZFS Dataset or a "plain vanilla" subdirectory? Web postings suggest that a "plain vanilla" subdirectory will not work with Windows 7 Backup.
• I don't understand the impact of Unix vs. Windows ACL on Windows Backup or Windows 7 in general.
• I want to know if bootdisk initiated Windows Restore will find a backup stored in the "root" of ZFS Dataset /mnt/windowsbackup/windowsbackup, or if I need to set up separate Volumes for each computer.
• Does the CIFS Share path impact if Windows Restore will find the backup

I think the windowsbackup folder is used for some temp files when the backup is actually in progress. Don't quote me because, as I said before, I ditched Windows Backup when I realized it really is about useless.

1. I meant a "plain vanilla" subdirectory, but you could use a dataset if you wish. To the Windows 7 machine though, you won't know there is any difference. So if a "plain vanilla" subdirectory won't work, a dataset won't either.
2. As for Unix vs. Windows ACL with Windows Backup, you'll have to read up on that yourself. I don't know anyone that takes the built-in Windows Backup tool seriously.
3. I don't know if the bootdisk can find anything from a network at all. Again, its something you'll have to figure out for yourself because I consider the Windows Backup tool to be a joke.
4. Again, no idea.. not enough experience with Windows Backup to tell you for sure.

My advice is to figure out everything and get it to do automated backups and actually do a restore to a spare hard drive and see it bootup and actually work. You may find you can't recover which defeats the purpose of a backup.

I know Acronis has major problems backing up over the network. Their forums are littered with people that get random nondescript errors when doing network backups.

I used to use Symantec Ghost for backups, but I stopped using them years ago when I found that I could do a backup with a verify to ensure the backup was good, but then any restore operation would find the files corrupt. Of course, if I chose to verify the backup files after the restore failed, it would pass. But then if you tried to do a restore, it would fail again. AFAIK Symantec never figured out why it happens for some people almost always and others never had the problem.

O&O Diskimage works fine for me, but you are forced to buy the Workstation version(vice the Home version) if you plan to backup and restore over the network.

 

[pirateghost]

Clonezilla ftw

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

 

[cyberjock]

Yeah, but Clonezilla only works with the OS shutdown. I use clonezilla for my linux machines. In a corporate environment where you will be restoring large numbers of machines from a single image Clonezilla is clearly a very good option. But for those of us that aren't highly skilled in 3rd party apps or want to do a backup without shutting down, there's little options.

 

[pirateghost]

Yeah. I would prefer to get a proper backup vs a backup while the OS is running. Its worth it for me to shutdown my PC once a week or 2 to make sure I have a complete image. I don't trust in-OS complete backups. File backups during OS sure, that's all handled via rsync.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

 

[esamett]

... deleted

 

[esamett]

...deleted

 

[gpsguy]

Was that the corporate version of Ghost or the consumer version? I've always used the corporate version, even back in the Win '95 days, when it was a product of Binary Research in New Zealand.

I've never had a problem with the restore operation.

I used to use Symantec Ghost for backups, but I stopped using them years ago when I found that I could do a backup with a verify to ensure the backup was good, but then any restore operation would find the files corrupt.

I also own Acronis and find backing it up from the GUI to be clumsy.

I know Acronis has major problems backing up over the network.

In the near future, I plan to do a trial of Drive Snapshot. It's similar to Ghost and will backup a running copy of Windows. While it's not free, it might be advantageous to me.

 

[cyberjock]

Yeah. I would prefer to get a proper backup vs a backup while the OS is running. Its worth it for me to shutdown my PC once a week or 2 to make sure I have a complete image. I don't trust in-OS complete backups. File backups during OS sure, that's all handled via rsync.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

I totally agree. Once every few months I do a clonezilla image of my systems, but every week I do my backup via OO Diskimage. I've actually done recoveries from the "live" images and they always worked fine. I know OO Diskimage marks your C drive as readonly and stores all pending writes in RAM while its actually backing up the disk to keep the disk's file system from changing during the backup, then commits the writes at the end of the backup. It only stores about 1GB of data, so if you start doing stuff like installing Microsoft Office during a backup(which I did do before) you get a warning when the write cache is almost full asking if you want to continue with the backup and flush the write cache or cancel/reschedule the backup for later.

I don't keep much data on my C drive itself. Most everything is on my FreeNAS server. With that being said, I've recovered from 5 month old backups and only needed to do some Windows and software updates.