FreeNAS ZFS Build opinion/Suggestions Appreciated

[odragon]

Hello world!

I am building my first FreeNAS and I wanted to get some opinion's on the build as well as have a few questions answered. Below is the build:

Intel Core i3-4170 3.7GHz Dual-Core Processor
ASRock E3C224D2I Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard
Kingston 16GB (2 x 8GB) Registered DDR3-1333 Memory
Western Digital Red 3TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive x4
Fractal Design Node 304 Mini ITX Tower Case
EVGA 500W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply

I intend to use this NAS as storage for my data and virtual machines as well as a media server. I am replacing a QNAP 251+ that is just not handling the plex server like it should.


So I have a few questions to piggy back here as well:
1. Does ZFS require an SSD? Is there a benefit to having it?
2. Is ECC required for ZFS? What are the benefits?

I was trying to research a bit myself but there is a lot of acronyms and other wording that confuses my tiny brain :) so any assistance would be greatly appreciated! Thanks.

 

[Ericloewe]

You should read the hardware recommendations guide, particularly the sections on RAM and PSUs. While you're at it, the boot device section as well.

As for requiring an SSD, I wonder where such a weird thought would come from. The answer is obviously no. You should read cyberjock's guide.

Both documents linked in my sig.

 

[odragon]

I appreciate your input. Little advice though...don't insult people. Just not a nice thing to do. To explain myself though I was under the impression that putting the FreeNAS OS on an SSD would yield faster cache reads. but thanks I will go look around more on the site and hopefully I will find something useful there.

 

[Spearfoot]

Hello world!

I am building my first FreeNAS and I wanted to get some opinion's on the build as well as have a few questions answered. Below is the build:

Intel Core i3-4170 3.7GHz Dual-Core Processor
ASRock E3C224D2I Mini ITX LGA1150 Motherboard
Kingston 16GB (2 x 8GB) Registered DDR3-1333 Memory
Western Digital Red 3TB 3.5" 5400RPM Internal Hard Drive x4
Fractal Design Node 304 Mini ITX Tower Case
EVGA 500W 80+ Bronze Certified ATX Power Supply

I intend to use this NAS as storage for my data and virtual machines as well as a media server. I am replacing a QNAP 251+ that is just not handling the plex server like it should.


So I have a few questions to piggy back here as well:
1. Does ZFS require an SSD? Is there a benefit to having it?
2. Is ECC required for ZFS? What are the benefits?

I was trying to research a bit myself but there is a lot of acronyms and other wording that confuses my tiny brain :) so any assistance would be greatly appreciated! Thanks.

I don't use ASRock boards myself, but I recall seeing threads here on the forum about particular models failing after a year or two of service - so search the forum and make sure you're not buying a 'problematic' motherboard.

ZFS doesn't require an SSD per se, but it needs to boot from something; a USB flash drive, an SATA DOM, a small SSD, or whatever. This boot device doesn't need to be large - 16GB is plenty of space - which is why many users choose a USB flash drive. The 16GB San Disk Cruzer Fit is a good choice and very reasonably priced. It's a USB 2.0 device, which is good because they run cooler than the USB 3.0 devices. But note that many users here prefer small SSDs because they're more reliable than flash drives. In either case, as long as you back up your configuration file you can replace a failed boot device, restore your configuration, and carry on without loosing any of your data.

Your HDD, case, and PSU choices are fine. I use an EVGA PSU myself and have had good luck with it. Its build quality is excellent. Seasonic is probably the most-recommended brand of PSU, but I don't have any personal experience with that brand.

ECC RAM is essential if you're interested in ensuring the integrity of your data. There is quite a bit of discussion about the subject here on the forum.

My advice is to take your time, study ZFS, study FreeNAS, and explore all of the excellent information available here before you plunk down your cash for a new system. Whatever you think your storage requirements will be in 3 years, double that - because you'll probably regret it if you don't.

Good luck!

 

[odragon]

I don't use ASRock boards myself, but I recall seeing threads here on the forum about particular models failing after a year or two of service - so search the forum and make sure you're not buying a 'problematic' motherboard.

ZFS doesn't require an SSD per se, but it needs to boot from something; a USB flash drive, an SATA DOM, a small SSD, or whatever. This boot device doesn't need to be large - 16GB is plenty of space - which is why many users choose a USB flash drive. The 16GB San Disk Cruzer Fit is a good choice and very reasonably priced. It's a USB 2.0 device, which is good because they run cooler than the USB 3.0 devices. But note that many users here prefer small SSDs because they're more reliable than flash drives. In either case, as long as you back up your configuration file you can replace a failed boot device, restore your configuration, and carry on without loosing any of your data.

Your HDD, case, and PSU choices are fine. I use an EVGA PSU myself and have had good luck with it. Its build quality is excellent. Seasonic is probably the most-recommended brand of PSU, but I don't have any personal experience with that brand.

ECC RAM is essential if you're interested in ensuring the integrity of your data. There is quite a bit of discussion about the subject here on the forum.

My advice is to take your time, study ZFS, study FreeNAS, and explore all of the excellent information available here before you plunk down your cash for a new system. Whatever you think your storage requirements will be in 3 years, double that - because you'll probably regret it if you don't. :)

Good luck!

Thanks so much! Very informative I really appreciate that! I think just need to spend more time here and look around. Thanks again though.

 

[Ericloewe]

I appreciate your input. Little advice though...don't insult people. Just not a nice thing to do.

Don't confuse terseness with an insulting tone. No insult was meant and the surprise expressed is real, since "requiring an SSD" is a highly unusual concept.

To explain myself though I was under the impression that putting the FreeNAS OS on an SSD would yield faster cache reads.

Well, that's a far cry from a requirement. Anyway, the matter is not so simple and cyberjock's guide is the best starting point. Short answer is no.

Let's backtrack to the RAM for a moment. All, and I do mean every single one - all LGA115x CPUs support UDIMMs only. That means no Registered RAM or LR-DIMMs.

 

[odragon]

Don't confuse terseness with an insulting tone. No insult was meant and the surprise expressed is real, since "requiring an SSD" is a highly unusual concept.

Well, that's a far cry from a requirement. Anyway, the matter is not so simple and cyberjock's guide is the best starting point. Short answer is no.

Let's backtrack to the RAM for a moment. All, and I do mean every single one - all LGA115x CPUs support UDIMMs only. That means no Registered RAM or LR-DIMMs.

Thank you for that but if you read it again it says "DOES ZFS require an SSD". This is not a statement but a question. In civilized society it would be considered rude to snark or verbally display your terseness to someone when they are inquiring about a topic you are familiar with. Basically the equivalent of asking your doctor a question about your health and he simply snarks and shows his surprise at what an absurd question you just asked. Would you want to ask any more questions? I don't think so. but thanks again for your input.

 

[Ericloewe]

This is not a statement but a question.

I said "thought", though this matter is within the realm of hair-splitting.

In civilized society it would be considered rude to snark

And where is the snark?

or verbally display your terseness to someone

Terseness implies verbal communication. You can't be terse if you're not talking to someone:

(of speech or style) Brief, concise, to the point.

Look, you want to feel offended, that your loss. I'm not here to offend people and I am going to keep my answers short when needed. Want me to write a book, do some crowdfunding and hire me to write it. Or read the documentation which is already posted to the forums, which does deal with the nuances of the topics discussed.

 

[Dice]

@odragon there is one way to reach a successful reliable FreeNAS installation. It starts by you reading advised documents and doing basic education on your own.
One way that will definitely not lead to that is maintaining a meta discussion on the tone of conversation on the Forums.
In the forums people are first advised to read on their own. When obvious questions are asked, that make <mind you> from a FreeNAS perspective, little sense - it is a tell of lacking efforts on reading. That will be called out. People who are ready for FreeNAS will take it to heart and start educating.

When called out, it is not to say you are an idiot in person.
Add a couple of posts with increased aggressiveness and lack of interest in learning, my judgement is likely to expand.

 

[odragon]

@odragon there is one way to reach a successful reliable FreeNAS installation. It starts by you reading advised documents and doing basic education on your own.
One way that will definitely not lead to that is maintaining a meta discussion on the tone of conversation on the Forums.
In the forums people are first advised to read on their own. When obvious questions are asked, that make <mind you> from a FreeNAS perspective, little sense - it is a tell of lacking efforts on reading. That will be called out. People who are ready for FreeNAS will take it to heart and start educating.

When called out, it is not to say you are an idiot in person.
Add a couple of posts with increased aggressiveness and lack of interest in learning, my judgement is likely to expand.

Oh please do expand! The problem with tech forums is that most people in the community choose to rally together and "call out" new comers to the site and make them not want to use the site simply for being ignorant. If you really are serious about keeping a strong, healthy community then you may want to consider this fact and try to be more welcoming. So far I have no desire to ever ask a question again here simply for the fact that two of the three people responding to this thread have made it a point to "call out" someone rather than constructively provide feedback or advice. I fail to see why people should be chastised for asking something- whether or not it has been repeated before.

 

[odragon]

I said "thought", though this matter is within the realm of hair-splitting.

And where is the snark?

Terseness implies verbal communication. You can't be terse if you're not talking to someone:


Look, you want to feel offended, that your loss. I'm not here to offend people and I am going to keep my answers short when needed. Want me to write a book, do some crowdfunding and hire me to write it. Or read the documentation which is already posted to the forums, which does deal with the nuances of the topics discussed.

Well according to you, "Don't confuse terseness with an insulting tone" you were being terse. So, also according to you, "Terseness implies verbal communication. You can't be terse if you're not talking to someone" so which is it? Were you being rude and insulting or were you being terse which, by your last remark, is impossible since you are not verbally speaking to me. Right?

Look I am not here to cause problems I have a problem when I ask a question and someone who is knowledgeable about the topic jumps in and feels the need to make useless comments about my thought process. It is just completely unhelpful and did not contribute anything of use to this thread. I hope other new comers see this thread and learn from my clear mistake to not ask a question unless you are sure of the answer (which means you wouldn't need to ask the question to begin with) or you will be mocked by the members who have been here a while. Great community.

 

[Ericloewe]

Well according to you, "Don't confuse terseness with an insulting tone" you were being terse. So, also according to you, "Terseness implies verbal communication. You can't be terse if you're not talking to someone" so which is it? Were you being rude and insulting or were you being terse which, by your last remark, is impossible since you are not verbally speaking to me. Right?

You are misinformed about the meaning of the word "verbal":

verbal ‎(not comparable)​

1. Of or relating to words.​

We are using words, therefore our exchange is verbal.

Do you spend your time arguing that your computer is rude because the error message goes straight to the point? I doubt it. So why are you arguing that sticking to concise speech is rude?

two of the three people responding to this thread have made it a point to "call out" someone rather than constructively provide feedback or advice.

What you're saying is that you expect us to regurgitate what is written in the documents I told you to look at. That is not going to happen. You are expected to do your own reading first and ask questions later. You don't even have to look around the documents, they were linked for you.

I fail to see why people should be chastised for asking something- whether or not it has been repeated before.

You weren't. You were told to read certain documents that would help. Documents that were compiled precisely because those questions pop up a lot.


To be perfectly honest, this attitude is profoundly irritating. You come here, expect to have the answers given to you on a silver platter, on a multitude of subjects, with a personalized answer. If you can't be bothered to read the documentation you were given, don't expect help. And don't start ranting about how the forum is mean and intimidating after you're told what you have to read.

Hell, you were given tidbits of information and still complained and still kept on complaining.

 

[odragon]

You are misinformed about the meaning of the word "verbal":

verbal ‎(not comparable)​

1. Of or relating to words.​

We are using words, therefore our exchange is verbal.

Do you spend your time arguing that your computer is rude because the error message goes straight to the point? I doubt it. So why are you arguing that sticking to concise speech is rude?


What you're saying is that you expect us to regurgitate what is written in the documents I told you to look at. That is not going to happen. You are expected to do your own reading first and ask questions later. You don't even have to look around the documents, they were linked for you.

You weren't. You were told to read certain documents that would help. Documents that were compiled precisely because those questions pop up a lot.


To be perfectly honest, this attitude is profoundly irritating. You come here, expect to have the answers given to you on a silver platter, on a multitude of subjects, with a personalized answer. If you can't be bothered to read the documentation you were given, don't expect help. And don't start ranting about how the forum is mean and intimidating after you're told what you have to read.

Hell, you were given tidbits of information and still complained and still kept on complaining.

"Thanks so much! Very informative I really appreciate that! I think just need to spend more time here and look around. Thanks again though." This is my post to the ONE person here that actually provided a little insight and suggested some documents to read ONLY. That was a perfectly acceptable answer and I have been looking further into my own research. YOU on the other hand did not reply in the same manner. You decided to make a "terse" comment about one of my questions and then proceeded to suggest reading documents. See the difference? I do appreciate your advice on looking at other documents and I am currently reading Cyberjocks PDF document that you suggested. I just didn't appreciate the fact that you felt the need to add a terse comment on top of the advice. To me, that isn't a welcoming thing when I am making my FIRST post to the site. I am sure you have been in some forum at some point and known very little about the topic you wanted to post about. It can be intimidating. So the whole point of this conversation now is to explain to you that when speaking to someone completely new, it would be nice to simply offer assistance and direct them to somewhere else instead of adding in your own two cents on top of the direction as it can impact their entire view of the community. Again, I appreciate you linking those docs and I am currently reviewing them.

 

[JoshDW19]

Can we bring the animosity down a notch and make sure we stay on topic guys? Please and thank you!

 

[odragon]

Can we bring the animosity down a notch and make sure we stay on topic guys? Please and thank you!

I agree :) . Either way I am looking forward to learning more about FreeNAS/FreeBSD and reading more forums here. thanks!