What are you trying to do with this?i've spent an hour looking for FreeNAS documentation that states USB 3.0 isn't reliable, works intermittently or isn't recommended for FreeNAS but i can't find where i read it. the post was from a few years ago, as i recall, i was hoping USB3.0 might be reliable when used in FreeNAS at this point. is it?
Last I read, USB 3.0 worked as well as USB 2.0. Neither was recommended for long term attachment of storage devices, though.
I have tried using USB with FreeNAS. It caused the server to crash and reboot. I don't suggest it. The problem appears to be that the controller will randomly drop the connection and FreeNAS is really funny about drives that disappear when they are being used.Can you elaborate? Because I am considering a backup solution for my server as external USB drives...
I have tried using USB with FreeNAS. It caused the server to crash and reboot. I don't suggest it. The problem appears to be that the controller will randomly drop the connection and FreeNAS is really funny about drives that disappear when they are being used.
No, not just the act of connecting it. The crash comes when you are using it and it suddenly pops out of existence (as far as the NAS knows) because some component of the USB interface just dropped the ball. When a drive is suddenly removed from the system, it can do unexpected things. It was worse historically, but may be more tolerant of it now. YMMVSo just connecting one USB drive would cause a crash?
The bus itself is fine, especially from 3.0 onward. The problem is that it won by being cheap, which means everyone is going to race to make the cheapest SATA/USB bridge they possibly can.A crash would be caused if connection to the USB drive is lost. USB is just unreliable crap.
USB stands for Unreliable Serial Bus.
In my eyes eSATA is a much better choice than USB. It's a shame that eSATA is not very common any more.
There is nothing saying that a backup drive or pool can't be in the same system as the main storage pool. click on the button in my signature for "Show: Emily-NAS". I have a backup pool. It is a 4 drive RAID-z1 pool using 5TB drives where my main pool was origninally two vdevs of 6 drives, 2TB each, at RAID-z2. I upgraded one of the vdevs to 4TB drives and now my backup pool needs to grow to keep up with the main pool capacity wise, but I have time.Would then a cloud backup be the only, most reliable option if USB is not reliable and a backup pool can't be inside the same machine as the main pool?
@Jatrabari , Some of those things can only be defended against by having an offsite backup. A local backup in the same server would be a defense against some accidents, and you can easily eject (offline without erase) the backup disks and take them away if you want to move them offsite. You can also setup a cloud based backup, but most of those solutions are going to have a monthly cost involved.PSU frying everything in the server, someone kicking the server, drunk/sleepy/inattentive admin destroying everything, fire, etc.
Thnx! You're right, I shouldn't blame the bus itself. Somehow I have the impression that it got worse since USB 3.0, but maybe I just have been unlucky with crappy hardware until now. Only 1 external drive I have works as I would expect, it's in a not so cheap external enclosure (~40 €) I put a former internal disk into. All other USB 3.0 stuff (even card readers) are absolutely unreliable.The bus itself is fine, especially from 3.0 onward. The problem is that it won by being cheap, which means everyone is going to race to make the cheapest SATA/USB bridge they possibly can.
Those crap controllers are ultimately the problem.
A crash would be caused if connection to the USB drive is lost. USB is just unreliable crap.
USB stands for Unreliable Serial Bus.
In my eyes eSATA is a much better choice than USB. It's a shame that eSATA is not very common any more.
No, not just the act of connecting it. The crash comes when you are using it and it suddenly pops out of existence (as far as the NAS knows) because some component of the USB interface just dropped the ball. When a drive is suddenly removed from the system, it can do unexpected things. It was worse historically, but may be more tolerant of it now. YMMV
@Jatrabari , Some of those things can only be defended against by having an offsite backup. A local backup in the same server would be a defense against some accidents, and you can easily eject (offline without erase) the backup disks and take them away if you want to move them offsite. You can also setup a cloud based backup, but most of those solutions are going to have a monthly cost involved.
I don't have the hardware configurations of all the other users memorized, but I do remember that there are several that insert disks into the regular hot-swap bays, establish a pool, make a backup of the primary data pool, offline the backup pool and then remove those disks to either move them offsite or put them into a fire-resistant box. Don't despair, there are many options.
Best to go with the bigger power supply to start because it doesn't use extra power to have a supply with more max capacity and then you don't need to change it later. In fact, it you want to go to 16 drives at some point, you should probably go ahead and get the power supply for that now. Larger supplies are usually more efficient, but do pay the extra for a gold rated supply.Here is also updated configuration. I am still deliberating on the size of the PSU. 550 W is calculated for 6 drives but 650 W could be enough for 9 if I decide to implement the backup pool + offsite hotswap...
Best to go with the bigger power supply to start because it doesn't use extra power to have a supply with more max capacity and then you don't need to change it later. In fact, it you want to go to 16 drives at some point, you should probably go ahead and get the power supply for that now. Larger supplies are usually more efficient, but do pay the extra for a gold rated supply.
Sorry, for some reason I thought you had planned more drives.So 9 HDDs (6 main pool, 2 backup pool and 1 hotswap) will be enough for me.
Sure, not arguing at all with that calculation. I still think it best to have the extra headroom as a precaution because I don't like to stress the equipment.the 550 W has been calculated according to jgreco's guide with 1.25x margin and that is right on the money as to 9 HDDs
I don't claim that it will make the supply last longer because I have no evidence of it, but that is my intuitive thought, if it is less stressed, it should last longer and, more important in my mind, be reliable.But does it benefit the PSU as less wear and tear and longer lifespan if it is used at low power levels
Well, as I see it, there are 4 options for backup without a second backup FreeNAS server:
1. External USB drive for main backup (not reliable, not an option)
2. External SATA port for an external drive (don’t have this in the MB or have to get a extra card just for this)
3. Backup pool in the same system as the main pool (can do this but it just feels wrong, would have to have a secondary backup (offsite, hot swap)
4. Encrypted cloud backup such as Backblaze B2 (not that expensive with my total data amount but would like to avoid if possible, not sure how this works in FreeNAS)
IMO, option 3 is the most probable one in my situation, even though there are the risk that Ericloewe mentioned, supplemented with either hot swap or cloud offsite backup. I had abandoned this option before but think I will consider this again…
Are there any other options that have not been mentioned?
Yup! All the benefits of an external USB drive, with all the benefits of a native disk. Just make sure you have a GOOD hot swap caddy (most are NOT built for this type of use, they are for quick recovery after the occasional disk failure NOT routine planned hot swaps!)Here's another option using some drive caddies from Addonics:
https://forums.freenas.org/index.php?threads/how-to-backup-to-local-disks.51693/#post-428001
Based on the post, @NASbox sounds pretty happy with it.
@droeders , the OP was already planning to use Icydock MB153SP-B units to get hot-swap bays. Unless the plan changed even more since the original post.Case: 12x 5,25” bays for up to 6x Icydock MB153SP-B 3 in 2 SATA Internal Backplane Modules for easy access and hotswap (plan to add more HDDs in the future for expansion up to 16 drives)