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How Stable are VMs Now?

NASbox

FreeNAS Experienced
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#1
IIUC there were major changes made to the Jails/VMs between 11.1 and 11.2.

FreeNAS is at 11.2-U5, which is pretty close to the end of the 11.2 series, is an upgrade from 11.2 to 11.3 going to require a lot of VM maintenance?

I have been considering setting up a couple of VMs, but things seem to be pretty unstable, so I have been holding off.

Any input would be much appreciated.
 

sretalla

FreeNAS Expert
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#2
The future of FreeNAS seems still to be using iocage for jails (with warden as a legacy passenger) and bhyve for VMs, with the rancherOS/docker VM concept dying in 11.3 (up to the user to create a VM and put docker in it if they so desire).

I don't see any reason at this point that a VM/jail built in 11.2 would not continue to be OK to use in 11.3.
 

sretalla

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#4
It would seem like insanity as we're at pre-beta stage with 11.3 not to have the 11.3 version that goes to beta just having this patch in it.

Clearly 11.2 updates need to come ASAP too.
 

seanm

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#6
That SA was announced 2019-07-24, it would be nice to have these security updates fixed faster somehow. 2¢. :)
 

NASbox

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#7
The future of FreeNAS seems still to be using iocage for jails (with warden as a legacy passenger) and bhyve for VMs, with the rancherOS/docker VM concept dying in 11.3 (up to the user to create a VM and put docker in it if they so desire).

I don't see any reason at this point that a VM/jail built in 11.2 would not continue to be OK to use in 11.3.
Thanks for this... I was just wondering how reliable VMs are on FreeNAS? I've been useing VirtualBox on my PC and haven't had any issues in over a decade... it just works. Are FreeNAS machines reliable, or are they still buggy?

There is getting to be a lot of interesting "cloud" software lie NextCloud / CRM Software etc. that I would like to set up on a linux VM (likely with multiple Docker containers) for use within my own firewall (pr through a secure remote accesss VPN for use outside the firewall). My FreeNAS is on all the time, and very stable, so it is the logical place for this type of application.

I'd be very grateful if anyone who has experience with this type of thing would be willing to share their experiences.
 

sretalla

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#8
Are FreeNAS machines reliable, or are they still buggy?
I have a few VMs (linux and Windows 10) that have run without interruption for months at a time.

I have not played a lot with memory allocation tunables, but I do note some instability when jails are running resource-heavy tasks on the same host for long periods. I presume this is to do with ARC more than anything, so tuning the ARC max value would be the first thing to look at to give your VMs guaranteed RAM.
 

seanm

FreeNAS Experienced
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#9
There is getting to be a lot of interesting "cloud" software lie NextCloud / CRM Software etc. that I would like to set up on a linux VM (likely with multiple Docker containers) for use within my own firewall (pr through a secure remote accesss VPN for use outside the firewall). My FreeNAS is on all the time, and very stable, so it is the logical place for this type of application.
You can run nextcloud in a jail on your freenas. Should be less overhead than a VM. There are lots of threads on this forum about installing it.
 

NASbox

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#10
Thanks for the input @sretalla @seanm

I have a few VMs (linux and Windows 10) that have run without interruption for months at a time.

I have not played a lot with memory allocation tunables, but I do note some instability when jails are running resource-heavy tasks on the same host for long periods. I presume this is to do with ARC more than anything, so tuning the ARC max value would be the first thing to look at to give your VMs guaranteed RAM.
That does "instability" mean? Does the system hang? Data corruption? Freeze? or something else?

You can run nextcloud in a jail on your freenas. Should be less overhead than a VM. There are lots of threads on this forum about installing it.
Good to know.... Only reason I was thinking VM was control... How well are the packages updated? I was thinking that a small linux VM running docker may be the easiest way to have an easy to maintain system.
 

sretalla

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#11
That does "instability" mean? Does the system hang? Data corruption? Freeze? or something else?
Freeze/hang... basically needing reboot to work normally. No data corruption.
 

sretalla

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#13
@sretalla I assume you mean the whole machine had to be rebooted (not just the VMs)?
Can you give me an idea how much memory the box had and how much the VMs were using?
The box has 32GB, the VMs are 8 for Win 10, and 4 each for a couple of linux + a DockerVM. As I said, it seems to be when ARC is heavily used by my plex and sab jails, so I'm presuming it's a memory thing.

I only need to reboot the VM(s), which is something that has improved in recent builds of FreeNAS, I used to need to restart entirely as the VMs would claim they were unable to start in past version in the same conditions.
 

seanm

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#14
Good to know.... Only reason I was thinking VM was control... How well are the packages updated? I was thinking that a small linux VM running docker may be the easiest way to have an easy to maintain system.
I have yet to actually use jails myself, so I have no first hand experience to share I'm afraid.
 

NASbox

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#15
The box has 32GB, the VMs are 8 for Win 10, and 4 each for a couple of linux + a DockerVM. As I said, it seems to be when ARC is heavily used by my plex and sab jails, so I'm presuming it's a memory thing.

I only need to reboot the VM(s), which is something that has improved in recent builds of FreeNAS, I used to need to restart entirely as the VMs would claim they were unable to start in past version in the same conditions.
Thinaks @sretalla - That seems like a very heavy memory load --- 50% of the machine memory. When you say resource heavy tasks, can you give an example? If anyone else has can offer input it would also be much appreciated.
 
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